Deep Conversations

[BossBoy93 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BossBoy93]

I was always told to be a God fearing man and that God is everything and I should love God and give him all the credit for any succsess I might have. But recently I have been thinking... If God is in us then doesnt that make us God? If we carry God around in us then we are all God in everything that we do. I believe what people call God is really just ourselves. We are in full control of everything in our lives. We have no one but ourselves to blame for our successes or failures. Its all on us.

I grew up in a religious home where I was told if I didnt believe that God died and protects me everyday that I would go to hell. I feel like if I don't believe it then I don't believe it. I cant just take your word that someone died for me. I have to know. I could never fully believe that.

I believe in myself and my power to acheive anything and that there is nothing to ever fear or back down from. The world is ours to work with. I have a positive outlook and help anyone I can because doing good creates good. I just cant see where God fits in. I have found myself but not through church and people keep trying to make me feel like its wrong

[Guidebox Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Guidebox]

I grew up in the same situation as you, and though I didn't follow the same path to logical thought as you, I first took notice of the world as a whole thanks to Richard Dawkins. We both grew up in the USA which is predominately Christian/Catholic, which gives us a predominately high chance of being born into one of those families. However, had we had been born in Kolkata, we would probably had been born into a Hindi family; in Pakistan, probably Islamic. Hell, had we been born in Iron Age Scandinavia, We would be worshiping Thor.

The point is everything progresses, and now, in the 21st century, we can safely come to the logical conclusion that: There probably is no god enjoy your life, its the only one you'll ever have.

The reason I add Probably is because logic --after studying it formally-- teaches you a few fundamental points, but the most important in our case is that: Never believe something to be completely proven unless it is has been, undeniable, been proven false. However, the evidence points to it being Highly Unlikely, which is the other point of logic, if the evidence points toward a conclusion, that conclusion is usually correct, IF all of the variables and the perspectives of those variables is true.

And I could go on for days lol.
But back to the point you made... I don't call myself an atheist or an agnostic, or even an apatheist.. Whenever someone asks me my religion, I simply say I am a human being on a beautiful blue dot SOARING around the amazing life giving nuclear explosion we call the sun. I have the opportunity to live my life CONSCIOUSLY. And in the words of Dr. Neil DeGrasse Tyson, "once you attach an -ist, -ian, or -ic you attach a thousand generations of baggage to that persons persona"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Di73YH8vW7g

[Toadstool Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Toadstool]

I grew up in a religious home where I was told if I didnt believe that God died and protects me everyday that I would go to hell. I feel like if I don't believe it then I don't believe it. I cant just take your word that someone died for me. I have to know. I could never fully believe that.

Depends on how you look at that. If you are God and you don't believe in yourself and you don't do everything you can to further your impact or role in the world, then maybe you will end up in your own personal little hell that you built for yourself.

[ino Senior Member Member of the Month June 2017 Find all posts View Profile Close ino]

Having had several life-changing mystic experiences, as well as paranormal experiences that I cannot deny the reality of, inevitably it has made me question the notion that we have about the deity we call 'god'. Personally I see how induced fear from the establishments behind the organised religions (not just Christianity), cripples a lot of us from thinking critically. Yes, fear is a powerful tool to control the masses ("You'll go to hell acting for thinking like that!") I remember already as a child (long time before my mystic experiences) when hearing the stories from the Old Testament, I was already then thinking: "Those things that god commands on people and the deeds that he acts out, are not from a good god!" That god was letting the Angel of Death let the first born children die if there was not a symbol painted over the doors, or that god just wiped out a city - like if an atomic bomb was released upon Sodom & Gomorra - just because the citizens were not living a certain moral way that this god wanted them to live, seems quite pety and evil really.

Already around the age of four, I remember feeling fear because I couldn't like the god from the Old Testament from the stories I was told. Then I had my first emotional and mental rebellion against the Old Testament: If I - as a normal human being -felt compassion and felt it was forgiveable the many things done by humans in the old Testament, which that god didn't forgive, then this Old Testament god could not really be god. Thinking these thoughts as a small child I was trembling with fear of not being able to push away these thoughts; I simply couldn't deny this personal realisation about the Old Testament's god not really being a very nice god at all.

And many years later, after my first mystic experience a teen, I later on get to read some theological text, and I read a paragraph from the Gnostics ("Gnostis" means 'knowledge' and they were an early Christian group that were wiped out together with the many other early Christian rivals from the group that later became the Roman-Catholic organized chuch)... where the Gnostics were questioning a lot of the texts from the Old Testament. Like when God says: "You shall have no other gods than me!", then in the Gnostic texts another voice of spirit comes even from a higher place, responding to this [first] god saying: "You are a jealous god!". This second voice implying that the Old Testament god was a demi-god; that the Old Testament god was telling people not to have other gods indicated that this god was not at all the supreme deity of the universe, but rather a lower form of power. (A demi-god.)

Satan was indeed a concept back in the early Biblical days, where Satan actually means "The opposer", also quite early interpreted as "The deceiver". Satan was not at all the demonic horned presence of rage and chaos as he was much later culturally to be shaped and perceived as. Satan was simply the opposer of the certain belief from the Judeo-Christian teachings. If we look at the connection of mythological and written sources between the Judeo-Christians, we see that it is a concept of a war in heaven. And I am sure that most of you have heard how god's favourite archangel Lucifer (which means "The bearer of Light") was tossed out from the heaven along with those who supported him. There are lots of different old written mythology around this 'war in heaven'. Old writings also imply that Lucifer in one of these old myths defended the human kind and put in a good word for the humans, at a time when god was dissatisfied with the human kind. Other myths has it that Lucifer were jealous of the humans since god ranked the human creation so high, and even ranked the human creation to be a better creation than his angels. This last one is the most myth and a propaganda spread from the established church.

Hell was not a concept in Christianity before a lot later. If I remember it correctly, even after the council in Nicea in 325 ad, hell wasn't created the way Christians perceive it today. The concept of hell was a gradual religio-political development that has its roots back in the purification process that occurred with the human soul after death (in Jewish this purification process is called Gehinnom), and it's pretty much what was much later known as purgatory as the Christian counterpart. The soul needed to be purified for the 'uncleanliness' that had stuck on the soul after a life on Earth, and it lasted for around a year. No more. After this cleansing the soul moved on, and from Judeism it then moved on to what I assume is the Jewish perception of heaven. It was no eternal punishment in that 'purgatory realm'. No torture. No devouring fire. No horned beings. No devil thrusting a fork up your ass. Gehinnom was simply a relatively short purification process. Scholars of theology agree that the later created idea of an ever lasting hell was a mixture of many old religious notions and myths; mainly this Gehinnom (purgatory) was mixed with pre-Christian pagan beliefs. Only gradually it became the common idea of hell; which included the devil and his demons residing in either a cold or a hot realm where human souls would be lost for an eternity in a tortured state. This idea of hell was not at all a conception in scripture nor among humans before many hundred years after the first Christians lived and died. Christianity was rather 'old' before the common conception of hell was shaped.

I thought as a child that the Old Testament should never have been put together with the New Testament - and I still think the same today.

Then to the question why there's so much suffering in the world? And then when it seems like innocent people are struck by disaster? Other religions speak of karma. I am not truly a great believer in karma either - not in its literal interpretation at least. Surely, if you go and hit a people in their faces, you are likey to get a punch back again. That cause and effect is reasonable. But karma as in past-life energies (or collective deeds) coming to haunt you lifetimes later, I am not really a believer in.

But do I believe in a God? Yes, I would say that I do. And I find value in the New Testament with its teachings of love, but I don't feel at all that there is something good about the god from the Old Testament. When reading the words of Jesus, we see that he had verbal fights with the old Jewish scholars, and when someone was referring to the old laws from Moses, he said something like: "Do you rely more on the old laws than on me?" Now it's been twenty years ago since I read the whole bible from A to Z, so cut me some slack here regarding the exact detals, but the bottom like is that Jesus was a rebel for his time, and the way I (and a lot of other people) see it, he spoke of forgiveness and love and to me it appears that he came wth a new message, which was about tossing away the old laws - meaning to discard the ideas that we see in the Old Testament with its vengeful and jealous god.

So how exactly is god like and how does god work? That is something I wouldn't dream of to write about nor to pretend having the answer for. But as I briefly mentioned above, since I don't believe in 'laws' (like karma) in the way it traditionally means, what makes good and bad things happen on this planet? I certainly don't believe that everything bad or good that happens on this planet happens because of intervention of a god or a devil. We definitely doesn't need a devil for evil things to occur on this planet. And I know that disbelievers in anything spiritual will say that we don't need god to have good things happen on this planet. (They will say 'on contrary' that religion is the cause of most evil that is happening on this planet.)

Nevertheless, I do believe that god - an universal power/consciousness, be it impersonal or personal regardless of religous beliefs - can intervene, especially as in showing grace when unexpected, and I also do believe that opposing spiritual powers can do the same intervention.

But I also believe that we ourselves - by what kind of thoughts and emotions that we are cultivating and allow to flow through our minds and bodies - that we ourselves decide what we will become. Good or bad persons. Or something in between.

For those who think of themselves as their own god in their own lives, I have to think of the saying: "God helps those who help themselves."

Sometimes it seems like it is a truth in that saying. But as my personal mystic experiences showed me, at least [to me] it is much more to life than any established religious or personal cosmologies can explain well enough.

Life is a mystic journey, and the different traditional religions have tried to make sense out of it the best way they can. But also we should have in mind that the moment a set of beliefs are put in a system with religious leaders to admister them, they easily become corrupt.

Look at life [physically and spiritually] the best way we can with eyes of love, and the best we can without the filter of fear, and I think we get closest to the truth; be it whether we are believers in anything spiriual or not.

[BossBoy93 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BossBoy93]

^^^ Amazing post.

I feel as tho nature and God would be the same thing. Like, perhaps energy is God. Since everything is energy. I feel like the answer to all this religion nonscence is very, very simple and that I am really close to finding it in myself. Its like I can feel all my questions about be answered. lol I hope that doesnt mean Im about to die.

Im waiting on a friend to pick me up right now and we are going to do acid. It will be my first and last time experiencing it. Ill post what goes down on this thread. Im thinking of bringing a pencil and notebook. I have always been so deep I want to remember what I think about while on acid.

[ino Senior Member Member of the Month June 2017 Find all posts View Profile Close ino]

^^^ Amazing post.

I feel as tho nature and God would be the same thing. Like, perhaps energy is God. Since everything is energy. I feel like the answer to all this religion nonscence is very, very simple and that I am really close to finding it in myself. Its like I can feel all my questions about be answered. lol I hope that doesnt mean Im about to die.

Im waiting on a friend to pick me up right now and we are going to do acid. It will be my first and last time experiencing it. Ill post what goes down on this thread. Im thinking of bringing a pencil and notebook. I have always been so deep I want to remember what I think about while on acid.

Thanks for appreciating my post. Yes, I also think of God as an all-permeating force. Total consciousness, energy. Different semantics, same thing. Being all-permeating, it also resides in the nature, and also god would inevitably be a part of ourselves.

I am against all drugs, but I have read about LSD and I sincerely believe it has been some anti-propaganda against it after the amoral and fringe experiments that occurred in the 1960s, but as early empirical data (and anectodes) have shown that people who have severe neurosis (and even psychosis) may be completely healed after having used LSD under supervision, LSD surely should be looked more into by the psychiatric profession.

Yet, I wished you wouldn't do the LSD trip. There are certain risks (like the amount or the purity of what you ingest.) But of course you are your own decision maker in your own life.

Though if it would be used under supervision from some outside professional person, I would support it.

Anyway, good luck! I look forward hearing the details from it later. :-)

[Toadstool Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Toadstool]

I don't know much about God. Then again, no one does. God is unknowable. You can't possibly understand it. It would be like a blind man asking you what the colour green is like.
You could try to describe it to him. "Oh, it feels cool and soothing." Then another blind man asks you what the colour green is like and this time you describe it differently. "Oh, the colour green is calming. Kind of like jazz." Then, the next thing you know the blind men are fighting and arguing with each other about what the colour green is like, and they're trying to kill each other because each of them thinks they are right.

What you think to be God and what God is is never going to be the same, for you, or for anyone. Do you really think this all-eternal being would create the complex inter-dynamics of the atoms, the molecules, the whole world and the creatures, the sun, the moon, the stars and the universe JUST for you to bow down and worship? What's that big brain of yours for?
Man-made religious institutes and God are separate. You worship God in your own way. if you think God is nature, then be kind to nature and leave a trail of generativity in your wake. That's what I'm trying to do with my life. Tear down the bad and build up the good. If there is a being in the sky, then that's what he'd want. If that sends me to hell, then GOOD, that's where I'd want to be. However, I don't think that being in the sky really concerns itself with any dogmatic rules like we do. That would make God human-like,and understandable.

[BossBoy93 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BossBoy93]

@Toadstool
Well I say, since God is energy then we should find out about it and what it was capable of, how it is made, ect. ect.
@Ino I agree some what. I do not like drugs either though I do not view marijuana as a drug. I took the LSD tabs a couple of minutes after I made this thread so I'm waiting now, do not know if I feel it yet, I might eat another brownie after it starts and I am comfortable with it.

I have done an abundance of research on lsd. I am doing this for creative insightive purposes. Lots of geniuses have used this at least once in there lives.

[Toadstool Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Toadstool]

BossBoy, There are lots of thoughts in the field of energy cultivation and exploration. You may want to look into meditation. Spirituality offers many insights without the frame of religion.

[BossBoy93 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BossBoy93]

I have looked into meditation. I can meditate or go alpha whenever I want know matter what I'm doing. I am completely spiritual and have no religion

[MrBigDick Retired ModeratorPEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close MrBigDick]

I used to question certain aspects of life where God is concerned. I was raised in a religious based home also, although I was never told if I didn't believe I was going to hell......that seems a bit harsh to me. I choose to believe because I choose to. I pray and try to attend church regularly.

As for taking acid............I'll never understand why anyone would choose to put any type of drug into their body.......JMO

[BossBoy93 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BossBoy93]

We put drugs in our body all the time, like drinking coke, or taking vitamins or supplements. LSD has been proven to help people. Not that thats my excuse for trying it. I just want to experience it. I have read great things

[Vulture Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Vulture]

HEy bro I want to hear your experience with LSD...Let us know how it was..I want to do it too, mushroom, LSD, DMT, Saliva and basically anything to find a answer to the biggest mystery on earth, whether there is anything that we do not see..supernatural, dimensions, jinns, whatever..

[Padawan787 Moderator ReservePEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close Padawan787]

I grew up in a religious home where I was told if I didnt believe that God died and protects me everyday that I would go to hell

Love me or go to hell for an eternity of suffering.

Gotta love the compassion and unconditional love that God provides.

[BossBoy93 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close BossBoy93]

@Padawan, Exactly, love me are an eternal in hell. That cant be how death works.

I have taken it. I got 6 tabs for 150 dollars. I took one earlier first so I could kinda get a feel for it. When my girl wakes up she and I are taking the other three. I might just take 2. Im reading up on it as we speak

Right now I feel spaced out. Its easy for me to get lost at thought staring at something. The lamp on my dresser is the only light in my room so its making everything feel deep.