"Fuck yes" or no.

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

Clearly the author was looking to employ some shock-and-awe as he packaged what I feel is pretty good advice; "If you're not really (sincerely) into another person or they are not really (sincerely) into you; look for someone who fits that bill."

When both parties are really into each other they are more willing to forgive slights, work with each other, and do thing to please the other. Good, open communication maintains that willingness.

But if you don't have that willingness because you or she feels you are "settling" for someone to "make it work" then it is an up-hill battle from the start.

[closed224 Senior Member Member of the Month Dec 2014, Feb 2017 Find all posts View Profile Close closed224]

PUA garbage. There is nothing about a relationship and the true give and take between two humans in that article. Shock and awe or not, needing to justify that article to try and make it fit the basic give and take of a relationship is not an excersizes I need to engage in. I simply stated that give it good credit is totally inverse to the stance Pegasus normally presents. In other words I say NO to this type of dehumanizing PUA garbage.

[closed224 Senior Member Member of the Month Dec 2014, Feb 2017 Find all posts View Profile Close closed224]

As to growing apart. We each and everyone of us is responsible for our own actions and decisions. That being true, we determine how we grow. Passing that responsibility off as it just happened is never acceptable to me. It is not required to stay with someone you don't want to be with, but someone is making a choice. There is never an arbitrary occurance in a decision to marry or a decision to divorce. Someone or more than one someone's hopefully are making choices. It does not just happen. Choosing to grow apart is still a series of choices.

[ScarletSkull Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ScarletSkull]

I totally did not read that article as PUA nonsense. I will agree, however, that it is written from the standpoint of someone who would rather be alone/single than be in a relationship that's unhealthy in some sense, which is also where I am at. I did not get any sense of "ditch your longterm partner if you aren't still saying fuck yes" but rather I thought he was mostly talking about the beginning stages of a relationship. Definitely a matter of perspective.

Oh and also - regarding the "improve oneself" thing... every single person on this planet has room for improvement. I have a male friend in his twenties and ever since I have known him (about 5 years) he's lamented about how he was so lonely and couldn't not find a girl.

The honest truth was, though, that he wasn't really much of a catch. Which is kind of rude to say, so I just told him to envision the kind of woman he could see himself spending the rest of his life with - and then thinking about what SHE would like to have in a man, and see if that jacket fit, so to speak.

Yes, I agree that people shouldn't change who they are according to what society thinks, or be untrue to themselves. But when a guy hasn't showered in a week and stinks of BO constantly, that might cause women to overlook him that wouldn't normally overlook him if he took better care of himself. That's a pretty easy fix. There are tons of little things like that.

Or the 40 yr old guy working part-time at a gas station is limiting his prospects, because very few women of that age would be interested in someone like that (don't misunderstand that one though - I'm not going to go down the "gold digger" route, but there is something to be said about a man who knows where he is going in life.).

I think if someone is lonely, a little introspection is a good thing. Asking why, figuring out the reasons, and seeing if perhaps some of them are things that can be addressed.

[PanBird Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close PanBird]

I totally did not read that article as PUA nonsense. I will agree, however, that it is written from the standpoint of someone who would rather be alone/single than be in a relationship that's unhealthy in some sense, which is also where I am at. I did not get any sense of "ditch your longterm partner if you aren't still saying fuck yes" but rather I thought he was mostly talking about the beginning stages of a relationship. Definitely a matter of perspective.

I agree. I found the article very interesting. My wife and I are not having "Fuck yes"-moments all the time, and it doesn't mean I'd break up in any way. But just as you said, I forwarded the link to a friend which I can see is in a beginning stage, and it has been a no-fuck-yes for a long time.

I'm also agreeing with Wishful here. Don't throw away anything based on selfish things. But don't throw away your life thinking it will be an easy fix and then realize 5 years later that it simply doesn't work out, you're feeling bad, depressed because of the relationship. Then you've thrown away 5 years of your life, and possible more.

Oh and also - regarding the "improve oneself" thing... every single person on this planet has room for improvement. I have a male friend in his twenties and ever since I have known him (about 5 years) he's lamented about how he was so lonely and couldn't not find a girl.

The honest truth was, though, that he wasn't really much of a catch. Which is kind of rude to say, so I just told him to envision the kind of woman he could see himself spending the rest of his life with - and then thinking about what SHE would like to have in a man, and see if that jacket fit, so to speak.

Yes, I agree that people shouldn't change who they are according to what society thinks, or be untrue to themselves. But when a guy hasn't showered in a week and stinks of BO constantly, that might cause women to overlook him that wouldn't normally overlook him if he took better care of himself. That's a pretty easy fix. There are tons of little things like that.

Or the 40 yr old guy working part-time at a gas station is limiting his prospects, because very few women of that age would be interested in someone like that (don't misunderstand that one though - I'm not going to go down the "gold digger" route, but there is something to be said about a man who knows where he is going in life.).

I think if someone is lonely, a little introspection is a good thing. Asking why, figuring out the reasons, and seeing if perhaps some of them are things that can be addressed.

I'm always thinking I can be better. Isn't that why we're all here anyway? Better stamina? Bigger penis? I had a bad self esteem 2-3 years ago thinking I couldn't do anything good. So I learned piano, guitar, started PE, started reading on self improvement in economy and dating. I started going to the gym resulting in a very fit body and many other things that I probably did.

I also met the love of my life during that phase. I say you're not "changing yourself" (like we previously used it as something negative) as long as you're changing by your own will.

If I've wanted to become a policeman since kid, I'm not "changing myself" when I go to the academy even though it will change me in many ways. It's just that life forms us, and we can choose how - and that is the way we want to.

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

PUA garbage. There is nothing about a relationship and the true give and take between two humans in that article. Shock and awe or not, needing to justify that article to try and make it fit the basic give and take of a relationship is not an excersizes I need to engage in. I simply stated that give it good credit is totally inverse to the stance Pegasus normally presents. In other words I say NO to this type of dehumanizing PUA garbage.

Not sure why you are so virulently aggressive about comments that don't disparage this article but you are the only one to have interpreted it as PUA propaganda.

[TheGreatDivider Senior Member Member of the Month Dec 2015 Find all posts View Profile Close TheGreatDivider]

Pretty good advice for the most part. I don't necessarily agree with all PUA but I like Mark Manson's work.

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

Oh and also - regarding the "improve oneself" thing... every single person on this planet has room for improvement. I have a male friend in his twenties and ever since I have known him (about 5 years) he's lamented about how he was so lonely and couldn't not find a girl.

The honest truth was, though, that he wasn't really much of a catch. Which is kind of rude to say, so I just told him to envision the kind of woman he could see himself spending the rest of his life with - and then thinking about what SHE would like to have in a man, and see if that jacket fit, so to speak.

Yes, I agree that people shouldn't change who they are according to what society thinks, or be untrue to themselves. But when a guy hasn't showered in a week and stinks of BO constantly, that might cause women to overlook him that wouldn't normally overlook him if he took better care of himself. That's a pretty easy fix. There are tons of little things like that.

Or the 40 yr old guy working part-time at a gas station is limiting his prospects, because very few women of that age would be interested in someone like that (don't misunderstand that one though - I'm not going to go down the "gold digger" route, but there is something to be said about a man who knows where he is going in life.).

I think if someone is lonely, a little introspection is a good thing. Asking why, figuring out the reasons, and seeing if perhaps some of them are things that can be addressed.

These are some great points Scarlet, that is a very tactful way to point out, "You're a complete shit-bag. Why don't you go do something with yourself?" (I know you didn't mean it like that)

Change is not comfortable; it is hard to look at one's faults without becoming becoming overly critical. However, no one changes if they are comfortable; in other words, no one improves if they are comfortable.

[TheGreatDivider Senior Member Member of the Month Dec 2015 Find all posts View Profile Close TheGreatDivider]

Wishful 10x8 what's going on with you? You seem pretty upset about this article and you're talking an awful lot about relationships. Are you having relationship issues or something?

[Aang Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Aang]

One thing that stood out for me, that I do agree with:

"Why would you ever be excited to be with someone who is not excited to be with you?"

I feel this way, about most things in life. No need to waste time, it's precious!

[spanky Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close spanky]

PUA?

Wow. Not at all. Not every "dating coach" or "life coach" is automatically PUA by advising on dating. PUA is misogynist and manipulative. This guy isn't saying that. It's about self-respect. He's saying
a) don't settle if you're not interested and
b) don't chase if she's not interested.
That seems like advice that plenty of people in disappointing or "difficult" relationships could do with.

Men everywhere bang on about how women are complicated and difficult to understand yada yada yada. They're not, she's probably just not that into you. PUA would say you need some "weird trick" to "unlock her sex button" or some shit. This guy is saying either she's not that into you, or you're looking in the wrong place. What's the argument with that?

If there's any issue with this at all (which was forwarded to me by a woman by the way) it's that this obvious lesson is so rarely understood by the far too many guys who insist that "bitches be crazy."

[spanky Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close spanky]

Treating people wrongly and not working to rectify those wrong behaviours speaks of having worse issues. The fuck yes, or no belief simply stated you will be what I want period. If I am tired of you fuck off. I will find the next brief interlude with no problems.
If I hurt you and take something from you, and you have the audacity to express any feelings about it, or express yourself in any way that doesn't make me feel totally good then fuck off I will find another brief interlude with some one who appears fuck yes to me.
The issue is with selfish manipulative people who don't see any need to work to better a relationship, no matter what they have done to another.

Anyway, It's not about treating people wrongly. Far from it. It's the opposite, treating people with honesty, being honest with yourself and understanding consent.

Seeing "issues" with a woman you're chasing and feeling like it's your "job" to "rectify" them is far from healthy for either of you, and far more dark-side PUA style than anything said here.

What "fuck yes or no" is saying is that if you don't have consent or someone who really wants you, it's not up to you to change them, it's up to you to suck it up and move on instead of being creepy and weird either hanging on in some vain hope that you can "fix" them, hurting yourself and scaring her in the process. What he's saying is that "no" is rejection, but so is "um, I'm not sure", and that means you as well as her. That's respect right there.

"Fuck yes" has to come from both of you. As opposed to "oh go on then" or "you'll do while I'm waiting". How is only entering into a relationship if both of you are totally keen bad advice? The article is saying don't settle or make do. It's not saying fuck da bitch while you can and move on when you're bored.

It's not about getting laid, it's about finding worthwhile and valuable relationships.

Find me a woman who feels similarly against this, yanno, women, unlike men, being the ones whose lives are constant catcalling and being chased. I'd be astonished if you can.

[Aang Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Aang]

I've been trying for a year and a half, to understand someone. When they only had to tell me "Hey, I only want to fuck". We never did have sex, you see I don't sleep around. But, I would have appreciated some honesty from the start. Seeing that I made myself clear from the beginning.

[spanky Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close spanky]

I think it's about having standards too. I know all too well what it's like to want someone and chase, but when it's just not working, refusing to admit that and not being willing to give it up.

Hell, I left somebody behind in Australia who I was hopelessly into, but she's not chasing back. She did for a bit, and then faded off into silence. And somebody else back here in the UK I "dated" (read: fucked all weekend) a few weeks back, she was awesome company, chemistry off the chart, but since then despite a world of "fuck yes" from her at the time, now she's just faded away.

Yeah it hurts, both of them, and the door's always open, but rather than sitting here waiting and hoping, beating myself up, I've gotta just suck it up and treat them both as a "no". The first one in Australia, she has problems, some crazy history to deal with. PTSD she said, I've told her time and time again I'll be there for her, but I can't "fix" her. The second one, here in the UK, I dunno, it started so well, and now nothing. It would be arrogant and downright weird if I were to see that as a "problem" with her that needs "fixing". It's not. It's a no. It's better this way, both for myself and for the pair of them.

[spanky Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close spanky]

And I can support this with a recent turn of events too.

I've just been chased by a woman, messaging me "so when are you going to ask me out then?". We've been on a couple of dates, #1 at a trendy bar, #2 to see Jurassic World and a drink after.

She's dead pretty, and pretty cool and interesting too, and I'd have no issue keeping her around at all, but she'll almost certainly only be a great friend. There's not "THAT" chemistry. It's not an outright "no" by any means, but it sure as shit isn't "fuck yes". So frankly, sorry, you're lovely and all, but it's a no.

How in any sense of ethics or love or respect is that PUA or any measure of bad? Wishful10x8, I'm genuinely interested in what I'm doing wrong here.