Black Lives Matter Movement?

[closed260 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close closed260]

How many cops have stated that?

Would you accept the word of the former Cheif of the Santa Fe police? A Black Police Chief Reacts to the Dallas Attacks - The Atlantic

[Tamora Retired Super Moderator Member of the Month Aug 2015 PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close Tamora]

And i'm telling u Mr confederate flag that those stats don't factor in the basic injustices that happen to black people on a day to day basis by cops like getting stopped for absolutely no reason but having dreadlocks and dark Skin. I dont even really expect you to understand because you are talking completely from outside the picture its like me talking to a NFL player about what the NFL is like without me ever playing and just talking about stats

Liam...no innuendos or name calling please.

This is how arguments start and threads get closed.

[CUSP82 Administrator Admin of the Month Dec 2014PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close CUSP82]

Want to see what another black police officer says?

Sheriff Clarke: Black Lives Matter Belongs With Groups Like These ? Bearing Arms

[closed260 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close closed260]

Okay, okay, I'm just going to stop you there. The wage gap, despite being "widely reported", is bullshit, a narrative peddled by the media to further a feminist agenda, just like the UVA rape hoax, the 1 in 5 rape statistic etc. It just shows that stats can be pick and chosen to further an agenda. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58arQIr882w

I have heard the how the "1 in 5" myth regarding rape spooled up and it concerns me too. So what can we do to prevent that? I've heard that we can't allow unsupported claims in arguments. There are some people, even here, who blithely ignore this process with claims to what they "know" or rather what they "feel". Often they resort to anecdote. Personally, I think youtube videos are a poor method to document references.

Also I appologize for my sloppy approximation, its not ~70% but closer to 77%. This, https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...18d_story.html , quotes the more recent "corrected for job type" of 92%. However, this begs the question, why do women not seek those better paying jobs and why don't they have as much job experience?

I feel Anne Marie-Slaughter and Claudie Gouldin has a fair argument why women do in fact face a real limitation: unequal burden of raising children. In short, they have to leave the workforce so they choose a flexible work schedule over pay. In one northern european country they encourage both fathers and mothers to take maternity/paternity leave so that all jobs will include that expectation. Others attempt to expand day-care coverage from just after maternity leave until full-day school begins.

As it looks like you prefer media to print this is the best I could find to describe it: The True Story of the Gender Pay Gap - Freakonomics Freakonomics

But getting back to the topic of this thread. Would you accept this as evidence that blacks are dis-proportionally targeted by police activity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statis...American_males 37% of prison imates but only 13% of population.

If you don't believe this, how do you explain the discrepancy?

[closed260 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close closed260]

Want to see what another black police officer says?

Sheriff Clarke: Black Lives Matter Belongs With Groups Like These ? Bearing Arms

Thanks cusp, very interesting. But I don't see him saying that blacks do NOT get targeted disproportionally. Nor does he say that the police are NOT showing signs of racism. Only that BLM has not distanced itself from violence, which I agree with.

Perhaps this is where we all stand: non-violent protest is good, BLM isn't non-violent enough, but blacks do experience a greater share the fallout of an over militarized police, a misguided War-on-Drugs policy, and lingering effects of racism.

[CUSP82 Administrator Admin of the Month Dec 2014PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close CUSP82]

The vast majority of police are not racists; just like the vast majority of doctors and lawyers and plumbers.

[rbi99 Retired Moderator Member of the Month Nov 2017PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close rbi99]

Civil Rights Timeline

The Civil Rights Movement was about the totality of everyday black peoples lives, not about one facet of it. However, just as their movement faced almost insurmountable odds against a very non receptive audience initially, it slowly began to take root in the American conscious. It was greatly aided by some very impressive black leadership. But the movement also made mistakes along the way as any new group or organization does. Maybe the BLM movement will eventually go down the wrong road and lose its true focus. Or maybe, just as the CRM found its purpose and direction, so will the BLM.

11 Major Misconceptions About the Black Lives Matter Movement

[resistor Member Find all posts View Profile Close resistor]

I feel Anne Marie-Slaughter and Claudie Gouldin has a fair argument why women do in fact face a real limitation: unequal burden of raising children. In short, they have to leave the workforce so they choose a flexible work schedule over pay. In one northern european country they encourage both fathers and mothers to take maternity/paternity leave so that all jobs will include that expectation. Others attempt to expand day-care coverage from just after maternity leave until full-day school begins.

You seem to be mistaking equality of opportunity with equality of outcome. The difference between the two is very, very simple. It comes down to individual choice. Many women decide to study Women's Studies as their majors and lock themselves into unskilled and low paying work for the rest of their lives. Many women make the choice to raise their children instead of working shitty jobs that they hate for 30 odd hours a week. Not because they were forced to, because they chose to. An the reason why is biology, and there's no over-riding that. Women are instinctively maternal, which means nursing the offspring and raising them, whilst the father is the breadwinner. You see it with humans, you see it with other mammals. If you really want mothers in the workforce you'd have to change human nature itself. You want to see an inconvenient pay-gap? What is the Gender Pay Gap? | Visual.ONS Women are paid more then men on average up until the age of 40. That blows the shit out of the claim women are paid less for the same work than men.

And for the love of god, I don't give a shit whether those stats are legit or not, don't quote wikipedia if you intend to make a valid point, there's a reason people get laughed at on campuses when they use it as a resource or reference. Maybe they are incarcerated at a higher rate. I'll take that as true. But do you know what black people do at a higher rate as well. https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...decoverviewpdf You'll notice that black people account for as much murder if not more as whites, half the rapes, more robbery,aggravated assault at more than half, these being some of the worst crimes someone can commit. And don't forget mandatory minimum sentencing, which was a demand from the black community to combat the crack epidemic of the 90s.

Edit:Found it. https://www.bop.gov/about/statistics...nmate_race.jsp Always use official sources when given the opportunity.

[gms585 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close gms585]

You seem to be mistaking equality of opportunity with equality of outcome. The difference between the two is very, very simple. It comes down to individual choice. Many women decide to study Women's Studies as their majors and lock themselves into unskilled and low paying work for the rest of their lives. Many women make the choice to raise their children instead of working shitty jobs that they hate for 30 odd hours a week. Not because they were forced to, because they chose to. An the reason why is biology, and there's no over-riding that. Women are instinctively maternal, which means nursing the offspring and raising them, whilst the father is the breadwinner. You see it with humans, you see it with other mammals. If you really want mothers in the workforce you'd have to change human nature itself. You want to see an inconvenient pay-gap? What is the Gender Pay Gap? | Visual.ONS Women are paid more then men on average up until the age of 40. That blows the shit out of the claim women are paid less for the same work than men.

And for the love of god, I don't give a shit whether those stats are legit or not, don't quote wikipedia if you intend to make a valid point, there's a reason people get laughed at on campuses when they use it as a resource or reference. Maybe they are incarcerated at a higher rate. I'll take that as true. But do you know what black people do at a higher rate as well. https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...decoverviewpdf You'll notice that black people account for as much murder if not more as whites, half the rapes, more robbery,aggravated assault at more than half, these being some of the worst crimes someone can commit. And don't forget mandatory minimum sentencing, which was a demand from the black community to combat the crack epidemic of the 90s.

Lets try to stay on the topic IDK why your talking about women's issues. Which IMO your ideas are way off base and bordering on passive misogyny. Save it for another thread about said topic.

With that out of the way.

The real poison pill in the black community is that when they were brought here as slaves those who did it robbed them of their culture. By doing so the US black had to invent his own culture. That invented culture is a direct caricature of our own ideals and way of life here in the USA.

Not to mention the impact the "war" on drugs had on their culture and community. To ignore the socioeconomic impacts of a whole race lacking a culture and entering the phase of integration during the most oppressive and damaging moral culture war of all time cant be understated. That said the black community does need to do a better job helping themselves and uplifting themselves. Their continued embrace of the "gangster" culture will only serve to keep them down. Until blacks stop accusing each other of acting white or bougie and begin to realize trying to be counter culture constantly keeps them at arms length of the equality they seek.

[resistor Member Find all posts View Profile Close resistor]

The rape statistic, which isn't even a real statistic, is just toxic to the environments where it is spread around. I don't know where these people get off but they're turning real usable anti-rape info into the stranger danger campaign of the 90s. That is teaching women a culture of fear of rape and unwarranted anger at the wrong target.

One thing I'll never understand is why feminists want the rate of rape to appear so high. It's almost like they are disappointed that rape is at a historically low level and descending all the time. https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc..._1993-2012.xls Yet when they are confronted with a real rape culture, like the ones that have been imported into Sweden and Germany(if anyone wants me to link the many instances of its manifestation, just ask) they keep quiet unless they absolutely have to speak out. Or they just stay quiet. Activist Admits She Lied About Rapists? Ethnicity to Avoid ?More Hatred Against Migrants? | Mediaite Article might be slanted but doesn't appear so.

[Tamora Retired Super Moderator Member of the Month Aug 2015 PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close Tamora]

Hey resistor...this thread is about the BLM movement, try to stay on topic please.

Your sub-topic is interesting too...so maybe start a separate thread so as we can have a coherent debate about both.

I confuse very easily!

[Tamora Retired Super Moderator Member of the Month Aug 2015 PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close Tamora]

For the record, I haven't been swayed by either side of the argument so far. Too many contradicting statements on both sides.

What I will say is that if a movement or protest group started in the UK with the title "White Lives Matter" it would come up against much scrutiny and be labelled as racist.

We have a similar problem in the UK with black minorities claiming unfair discrimination against them by police officers with laws such as "stop and search" and I do have a lot of sympathy with them as the statistics tend to back this up.

[gms585 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close gms585]

For the record, I haven't been swayed by either side of the argument so far. Too many contradicting statements on both sides.

What I will say is that if a movement or protest group started in the UK with the title "White Lives Matter" it would come up against much scrutiny and be labelled as racist.

We have a similar problem in the UK with black minorities claiming unfair discrimination against them by police officers with laws such as "stop and search" and I do have a lot of sympathy with them as the statistics tend to back this up.

are they supposedly roughed up more then white criminals also?
I honestly want to know if thats a claim with back-able stats in UK. Obviously they wouldn't be being shot or stabbed by cops but are the cops supposedly beating the S#$%T out of them at a higher rate? Are your crime stats by race as .... disproportionate as ours?

[Tamora Retired Super Moderator Member of the Month Aug 2015 PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close Tamora]

are they supposedly roughed up more then white criminals also?
I honestly want to know if thats a claim with back-able stats in UK. Obviously they wouldn't be being shot or stabbed by cops but are the cops supposedly beating the S#$%T out of them at a higher rate? Are your crime stats by race as .... disproportionate as ours?

In the year ending 31 March 2014, a larger proportion of those stopped and searched under section 60 were Black, compared with stops and searches under section 1 PACE. Data from the MPS show that 46% of all section 60 stops and searches were carried out on those who self-defined as Black, compared to only 27% of s1 PACE searches. The rest of England and Wales also shows a difference, with 13% of all section 60 stops and searches being carried out on those who self-defined as Black, compared to 4% of s1PACE stops and searches.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...top-and-search

I haven't searched for data regarding blacks being roughed up more than whites, but of the news stories about individuals in custody being forcibly restrained and then dying have been predominantly black from memory.

[rbi99 Retired Moderator Member of the Month Nov 2017PEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close rbi99]

Here is the answer ultimately, please watch.

Opposing protesters meet in Dallas