The Decline in the US Standard of Living over the Past 40 Years

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

Hmm, extremely reductive and short-sighted perspective. As productive as saying to Third World Nations "earn more money you losers".

I'm not sure what the incarceration rate has to do with standard of living. Perhaps you could help me understand.

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

Holistic does not include assured access to decent, affordable health care, a secure retirement income or affordability of higher education?

Hand selected to make a point.

Holistic does include those things, but it also includes many, many other things. These things carry a value relative to the nation. It also compares those things to a standard that is applicable to other nations. It also compares them to the inflation rate over the years.

You have elected to ignore these many, many other things. Putting on the blinders almost makes your argument plausible; narrow, but plausible.

[Pegasus AdministratorPE Gym EditorPEGym Hero ☺ Admin of the Month Mar 2015 Find all posts View Profile Close Pegasus]

I'm not sure what the incarceration rate has to do with standard of living. Perhaps you could help me understand.

Oh wow, the guys WORK WON'T BELIEVE THIS.

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

Perhaps you can explain then Peg.

Here is the list used to determine Standard of Living

• income
• quality and availability of employment
• class disparity
• poverty rate
• quality and affordability of housing (For related reading, see Mortgages: How Much Can You Afford?)
• hours of work required to purchase necessities
• gross domestic product (GDP) (For more insight, see Don't Be Misled By Gross National Product.)
• inflation rate (See our Inflation tutorial for more.)
• number of paid vacation days per year
• affordable access to quality health care
• quality and availability of education
• life expectancy
• incidence of disease
• cost of goods and services
• infrastructure
• national economic growth
• economic and political stability
• political and religious freedom
• environmental quality
• climate
• safety

Where does incarceration rate fit?

[Pegasus AdministratorPE Gym EditorPEGym Hero ☺ Admin of the Month Mar 2015 Find all posts View Profile Close Pegasus]

This is a good point but not the point of the original post. However, it is a strong accolade for the four countries which now rank higher than the US.

He said that the standard of living is lower now than it was in 1970. Not only is this statement pure fiction by every holistic measure of the standard of living, but it is a poorly defended position; hand selecting specific items to make a point.

Actually the number of countries varies depending on the study, most are more then 4 countries. I will warrant the U.s. is a good place to be rich in .
I have to say as an aussie I am disappointed we seem to be following the U.S. path.

[stilltoosmall Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close stilltoosmall]

[QUOTE=namsokiek;917337]Perhaps you can explain then Peg.

Here is the list used to determine Standard of Living

• income
  
• quality and availability of employment
  
• class disparity
  
• poverty rate
• quality and affordability of housing (For related reading, see Mortgages: How Much Can You Afford?)
• hours of work required to purchase necessities
• gross domestic product (GDP) (For more insight, see Don't Be Misled By Gross National Product.)
• inflation rate (See our Inflation tutorial for more.)
• number of paid vacation days per year
• affordable access to quality health care
  
• quality and availability of education
• life expectancy
• incidence of disease
• cost of goods and services
• infrastructure
• national economic growth
  
• economic and political stability
  
• political and religious freedom
  
• environmental quality
• climate
  
• safety

Where does incarceration rate fit?

Those in BOLD.


--

Inequality and crime:

Crime rates and inequality are positively correlated within countries and, particularly, between countries, and this correlation reflects causation from inequality to crime rates, even after controlling for other crime determinants

INEQUALITY AND VIOLENT CRIME*

PABLO FAJNZYLBER,
University of Minas Gerais

DANIEL LE******,
World Bank

NORMAN LOAYZA
World Bank

http://siteresources.worldbank.org/D...Inequality.pdf

--

Environment and crime:

How Lead Caused America's Violent Crime Epidemic - Forbes - most evidence based, but it is likely other unproven health/environment/poverty/crime effects are pretty abundant.

America's Real Criminal Element: Lead | Mother Jones

[kickinthemebs Senior Member Member of the Month Feb 2014 Find all posts View Profile Close kickinthemebs]

It is an indicator of the disparities in the U.S. standard of living. It is far too simplistic to merely state that more people commit crime in the States than anywhere else, while not looking at the sociological reasons underpinning such absurdly high levels of incarceration. Taking the average of a particular standard of living does not paint an accurate picture of the well-being within a population as you could have a minority wealthy individuals, with the majority in poverty. Here is from the link you sent previously, I have highlighted standards of living that may help illustrate why the States has such a disproportionate incarcerations per capita.


Standard of Living
Standard of living generally refers to the level of wealth, comfort, material goods and necessities available to a certain socioeconomic class, in a certain geographic area. An evaluation of standard of living commonly includes the following factors:

• income
• quality and availability of employment
• class disparity
• poverty rate
• quality and affordability of housing (For related reading, see Mortgages: How Much Can You Afford?)
• hours of work required to purchase necessities
• gross domestic product (GDP) (For more insight, see Don't Be Misled By Gross National Product.)
• inflation rate (See our Inflation tutorial for more.)
• number of paid vacation days per year
• affordable access to quality health care
• quality and availability of education
• life expectancy
• incidence of disease
• cost of goods and services
• infrastructure
• national economic growth
• economic and political stability
• political and religious freedom
• environmental quality
• climate
• safety

I'm not sure what the incarceration rate has to do with standard of living. Perhaps you could help me understand.

[kickinthemebs Senior Member Member of the Month Feb 2014 Find all posts View Profile Close kickinthemebs]

Haha stilltoosmall, you just bet me to it!

[namsokiek Banned Find all posts View Profile Close namsokiek]

It is an indicator of the disparities in the U.S. standard of living. It is far too simplistic to merely state that more people commit crime in the States than anywhere else, while not looking at the sociological reasons underpinning such absurdly high levels of incarceration. Taking the average of a particular standard of living does not paint an accurate picture of the well-being within a population as you could have a minority wealthy individuals, with the majority in poverty. Here is from the link you sent previously, I have highlighted standards of living that may help illustrate why the States has such a disproportionate incarcerations per capita.


Standard of Living
Standard of living generally refers to the level of wealth, comfort, material goods and necessities available to a certain socioeconomic class, in a certain geographic area. An evaluation of standard of living commonly includes the following factors:

• income
• quality and availability of employment
• class disparity
• poverty rate
• quality and affordability of housing (For related reading, see Mortgages: How Much Can You Afford?)
• hours of work required to purchase necessities
• gross domestic product (GDP) (For more insight, see Don't Be Misled By Gross National Product.)
• inflation rate (See our Inflation tutorial for more.)
• number of paid vacation days per year
• affordable access to quality health care
• quality and availability of education
• life expectancy
• incidence of disease
• cost of goods and services
• infrastructure
• national economic growth
• economic and political stability
• political and religious freedom
• environmental quality
• climate
• safety

Thanks KITM. I understand they identify disparity and these things are factors connected to crime. However, the original assertion is that the US standard of living (a measurement of all of these things for the nation) is lower now than in 1970; which is not supported by any evidence. The OP has hand picked certain elements of the measurement which he believes have decreased, but the "standard of living" (the combination of all of the items above) has gone up. I would also suggest the relative standard of living for prisoners is also higher now than it was for prisoners in 1970 (despite the higher number of felons). So, if we are diligent to compare apple to apple we will see the standard of living has improved. Sure some things return less of a benefit, but this is off-set by the higher value of other things.

This returns me to my original position. If we look at the value of our possessions (or at least the amount of money spent when they were purchased) and compare that to the value of our essential expenditures (basic nutrition needs, basic lodging needs) we see our basic needs are met sufficiently enough that we can afford luxuries (1 bedroom per child, 1 TV/1computer/1Xbox per bedroom, more than 2 cars per household, Iphones/Ipads/Ipods per person older than 12, etc.) well beyond our needs. These luxuries are essentially trade-offs in our society for pensions and health-care.

If US citizens truly valued pensions and health-care, then we would have it (law of supply and demand). However, we don't, we value the stuff we have more than we value the stuff we don't have.

[WIItard Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close WIItard]

You know, when the system finally fails and you don't get the Social Security and Medicare (because guess what, we CAN'T/WON'T pay).

Unless you are very poor you won't get Social Security. Most likely what will happen is the "rich" people won't get SS any more and an income level for that will be set. There will be no inflation clause which will effectively lower the "rich" person income lower and lower year by year. The same thing was done with alternative minimum tax.

Medicare???? Most likely socialized medicine is coming to the US, problem is the old system needs to basically bankrupt it's self or become to expensive for most people or companies to afford. That is under way at the moment. I know my family policy for 4 people costs $14,000 a year with a $2, 500 person deductible and a $5,000 family deductible. The average household income is around $51,000 a year so I'm not thinking most people can afford buying their own insurance. Do realize that socialized medicine is already here for families. The income limits for Medicaid go up with each child and I think you are eligible for Medicare if you have 2 kids somewhere up around $90 K a year. There are a huge amount of families going on Medicaid. The other side of that is companies simply aren't giving out raises, your raise each year goes to health insurance increases.

[OneEyedWilly Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close OneEyedWilly]

All the talk about GDP, quality and availability of housing and health care, class disparity, political and religious freedom, life expectancy, infrastructure, etc. all play a role in standard of living to be sure. However, and I'm not saying I have it as hard as many other people in the world, but Disposable Income has to fit in here somewhere! I can only speak from personal experience, but as time goes by my wife and I each have to do more work in the same amount of time with fewer people than in years past. Raises don't come as quickly as 20 or 30 years ago either. Federal taxes may be lower today, but taxes for state and local services are much higher as are insurance premiums. Sure, our standard of living may be decent, but our ability to purchase is less now than it was 35 years ago too.

[RoyCropper Banned Find all posts View Profile Close RoyCropper]

Chill out lads and stop complaining, work hard play hard.

[OneEyedWilly Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close OneEyedWilly]

Chill out lads and stop complaining, work hard play hard.

Work harder? It's easy to say that and dismiss those who may not have the same opportunities as you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/10/opinion/sunday/nicholas-kristof-is-a-hard-life-inherited.html?_r=0

[RoyCropper Banned Find all posts View Profile Close RoyCropper]

Work harder? It's easy to say that and dismiss those who may not have the same opportunities as you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/10/opinion/sunday/nicholas-kristof-is-a-hard-life-inherited.html?_r=0

Thats capitalism for you, dont like it go live in china im sure they have it better.

[MrPriapus Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close MrPriapus]

Nothing like blue collar economists arguing the irrelevant.