Hope and motivation. A cure for ED.

[EQr Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close EQr]

Just last week I was convinced that a venous leak was causing my ED. I’m 23, very fit and healthy (other than this ungodly frustrating plumbing problem), and I seemed like a candidate for venous ligation or embolization surgery. I was so convinced that I made an appointment with my urologist to discuss surgery details.

Since then, I stumbled across this site. Thanks to the wealth of information here I was exposed to the possibility of pelvic floor exercises (a.k.a kegels) as a way to cure ED. This has given me a glimmer of hope that I just might be able to avoid getting a knife in my dick. However, I had not seen medical studies on the effectiveness on kegels for ED, so a shadow of doubt still remained in the back of my mind.

Now I have, one study posted by Big Al and others from my own research. I cannot tell you how much reading the impressive success rates in these studies has given me hope and motivated me to maintain my kegel schedule. So I wanted to share these studies with anyone else suffering from this mother-of-all cockblockers--ED.

1. Randomised controlled trial of pelvic floor muscle exercises and manometric biofeedback for erectile dysfunction Randomised controlled trial of pelvic floor muscle exercises and manometric biofeedback for erectile dysfunction
In this study, subjects with ED did kegels daily for 3-6 months. 40% attained normal erectile function and 35% had improved erections.
This study is useful in that it also tells what kind of exercises they did. The references are also good.

2. Treatment of Erectile Dysfunction by Perineal Exercise, Electromyographic Biofeedback, and Electrical Stimulation
Treatment of Erectile Dysfunction by Perineal Exercise, Electromyographic Biofeedback, and Electrical Stimulation
After a 4 month kegel program (with electrical stim as well), 47% regained a normal erection and 24% improved. What really perked me up (!) was how successful the kegels were for patients with veno-occlusive dysfunction (what I think I have). 75% of this group regained normal erections!

3. Pelvic floor exercise versus surgery in the treatment of impotence.
Pelvic floor exercise versus surgery in the treatm... [Br J Urol. 1993] - PubMed result
This study was of ED patients with PROVEN VENOUS LEAKAGE and found that a kegel program was superior to venous surgery.



I would suggest anyone with ED at least read the abstracts of these articles. I hope they give you the same sense of hope and motivation to do your kegels as they did for me. I'm only on day 6 of my kegel routine, but I will report back after a month on how its working out.

[moxsum Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close moxsum]

Good luck man Honestly I would never consider having a knife taken to my dick. I think venous leakage is more rare then we think.. ED can be caused by many things and theres no need to assume venous leakage. Second of all.. even if a vein is "leaking" that may just be because theres not enough pressure within the chambers to close off the vein, which isnt a problem with the vein but a blood flow problem at its core.

[Unit Retired ModeratorPEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close Unit]

Outstanding post, EQr well done and Rep point for you. I've been a fan of Kegel for the past ten years, although I started them for the MMO thing. Thanks a again for sharing this information and the links. Good luck with your own personal study, I hope you fall into the 75% category.

[EQr Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close EQr]

Thanks for the good wishes fellas. This problem has affected more of my life than just my dick, so while I have to stop other exercises in 2 months (lack of privacy) I will be the Kegel King for the next 6 months at least.

Moxsum, you're right about assuming venous leakage. I've tended to think thats been my problem, but only because I don't have a better explanation, not because I have anything to support that conclusion. I'm seeing a urologist in 2 wks and was going to request bloodflow and imaging tests, but if things start to improve I might cancel. Honestly, I really don't care what the cause is if I can get my pecker working right. Anyway if he's anything like the last docs I've seen he's just going to say, "its all in your head, take these blue pills!"

Something in I thought was interesting in the second link was the explanation they gave for how kegels might help. They suggest kegels work by decreasing venous outflow (my guess is the increased muscle mass and tone closes off veins). Thought this was interesting because the explanations I've seen on this site suggest that kegels help by increasing bloodflow into the penis. Maybe they do both. I sure hope so.

If I can get my dick working right I swear I'm going to consider quitting my job and going to med school to study urology. Would be really interesting to study how all these exercises actually work and find ways to beat ED. Maybe also study exactly how penis enlargement exercises work and which exercises produce the best gains. (Though I will be convinced that they work if and when I see personal results).

I'm curious, would you even want the medical community studying penis enlargement exercises? Do you prefer this knowledge hidden on sites like this, or would you like to see it disseminated in the medical community and in mainstream society?

[Wantstobebetter Member Find all posts View Profile Close Wantstobebetter]

I don't know about the rest of these guys but personally I'd love to see more medical professionals look into these things. It could only be a good thing. With more people scrutinizing these exercises and perhaps even supplements and things like that then hopefully we'll have a better understanding on how they work. With such information PE would become more efficient and we'll have better knowledge on exactly what works and what doesn't which would save precious time and energy.

[flex Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close flex]

I don't know about the rest of these guys but personally I'd love to see more medical professionals look into these things. It could only be a good thing. With more people scrutinizing these exercises and perhaps even supplements and things like that then hopefully we'll have a better understanding on how they work. With such information PE would become more efficient and we'll have better knowledge on exactly what works and what doesn't which would save precious time and energy.

People from the medical profession have already done studies on pumps and extenders. Reviews were mixed but possibly more positive. But don't hold your breath waiting for studies on manual PE techniques like jelqing, ULIs, etc... I don't think it will happen any time soon, if at all.

[Wantstobebetter Member Find all posts View Profile Close Wantstobebetter]

People from the medical profession have already done studies on pumps and extenders. Reviews were mixed but possibly more positive. But don't hold your breath waiting for studies on manual PE techniques like jelqing, ULIs, etc... I don't think it will happen any time soon, if at all.

You may be right. There really is no money to be made in manual exercises and therefore no motive to study perhaps. But maybe we'll get lucky and some researcher who has learned about PE from this site and successfully used it will return the favor and study it.
The sad thing is scientists are supposed to study things for the sake of knowledge,not profit. Guess this is the world we live in now.

[EQr Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close EQr]

Yeah I agree there is not much financial incentive to study or prescribe PE. Who is going to wine and dine docs for prescribing manual exercises, or sponsor research on manual enlarglement? Aaron Kemmer and similar authors would certainly benefit, they should try getting investors to sponsor such research.

I also think liability is an issue. Docs have done studies on kegels, but those are very safe. While the risks of PE seem to be minimal when done properly, I've found a very strong temptation to overdo them. In a study of 50 patients, if just 1 injures themselves and successfully sues the researchers, thats going to put a hold on future research. That fear may be what has prevented any research thus far.

[Mr McPenis Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mr McPenis]

Just last week I was convinced that a venous leak was causing my ED. I’m 23, very fit and healthy (other than this ungodly frustrating plumbing problem), and I seemed like a candidate for venous ligation or embolization surgery. I was so convinced that I made an appointment with my urologist to discuss surgery details.

Since then, I stumbled across this site. Thanks to the wealth of information here I was exposed to the possibility of pelvic floor exercises (a.k.a kegels) as a way to cure ED. This has given me a glimmer of hope that I just might be able to avoid getting a knife in my dick. However, I had not seen medical studies on the effectiveness on kegels for ED, so a shadow of doubt still remained in the back of my mind.

Now I have, one study posted by Big Al and others from my own research. I cannot tell you how much reading the impressive success rates in these studies has given me hope and motivated me to maintain my kegel schedule. So I wanted to share these studies with anyone else suffering from this mother-of-all cockblockers--ED.

1. Randomised controlled trial of pelvic floor muscle exercises and manometric biofeedback for erectile dysfunction Randomised controlled trial of pelvic floor muscle exercises and manometric biofeedback for erectile dysfunction
In this study, subjects with ED did kegels daily for 3-6 months. 40% attained normal erectile function and 35% had improved erections.
This study is useful in that it also tells what kind of exercises they did. The references are also good.

2. Treatment of Erectile Dysfunction by Perineal Exercise, Electromyographic Biofeedback, and Electrical Stimulation
Treatment of Erectile Dysfunction by Perineal Exercise, Electromyographic Biofeedback, and Electrical Stimulation
After a 4 month kegel program (with electrical stim as well), 47% regained a normal erection and 24% improved. What really perked me up (!) was how successful the kegels were for patients with veno-occlusive dysfunction (what I think I have). 75% of this group regained normal erections!

3. Pelvic floor exercise versus surgery in the treatment of impotence.
Pelvic floor exercise versus surgery in the treatm... [Br J Urol. 1993] - PubMed result
This study was of ED patients with PROVEN VENOUS LEAKAGE and found that a kegel program was superior to venous surgery.



I would suggest anyone with ED at least read the abstracts of these articles. I hope they give you the same sense of hope and motivation to do your kegels as they did for me. I'm only on day 6 of my kegel routine, but I will report back after a month on how its working out.

Great post! I have been doing kegels for a couple of weeks, but haven't noticed much yet. I have been doing every other day (off,on,off,on etc) 10 sec holds front normal, front reverse, back, back reverse (all 4 variations) x 10, so 40 altogether.
The first study link you provided said to do a lot more but doesn't say about different variations, so maybe I'm wasting my time with the reverse ones? And it doesn't say how many seconds to hold for at maximum contraction? just a blank _

[not2big Senior Super ModeratorPEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close not2big]

People from the medical profession have already done studies on pumps and extenders. Reviews were mixed but possibly more positive.

Most Uros routinely recommend penis pumps for improving ED. In fact, most insurance carriers, including Medicare, cover most of the cost of penis pumps. Unfortunately, enlarging your dick to improve sexual pleasure, even for those with sub average dicks, is not considered an approved medical expense. I guess the executives of big insurance don't have balls big enough to make such decisions. How do we get them to join PEG to work on their short comings ?

[EQr Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close EQr]

Great post! I have been doing kegels for a couple of weeks, but haven't noticed much yet. I have been doing every other day (off,on,off,on etc) 10 sec holds front normal, front reverse, back, back reverse (all 4 variations) x 10, so 40 altogether.
The first study link you provided said to do a lot more but doesn't say about different variations, so maybe I'm wasting my time with the reverse ones? And it doesn't say how many seconds to hold for at maximum contraction? just a blank _

Yeah the first study link was pretty specific about the exercises, it just didn't say how long to hold. Probably because everyone's PF has a different starting strength. But I know when they tested the participants PF strength they had them hold for 10s/rep. I'm doing each hold (standing, sitting, lying) for 15 seconds, with 15 seconds between reps. Its a good balance for me: I can finish the reps but the last few seconds are a struggle. When I walk I hold the kegel at ~50% of maximum, anywhere from 20s to 3 min, depending on how far I'm walking. The only thing I do differently from the study is I do kegels every other day, like you. Once I get stronger I will go every day.

As far as the reverse Kegels go, I'm not doing them because I'm trying to do exactly what they did in the study. I would suggest not doing them until you get your EQ where you want it. If that study's routine works, why change it? From my limited knowledge of reverse Kegels they are more for PE than ED. I may experiment with them once I'm satisfied with my EQ, but til then I'm sticking to the regular kegels while standing, sitting, lying, walking, and post-pissing.

What exactly is the difference between front and back regular kegels? Does the front work more towards your nuts and back towards your brown-eye?

I've had my first signs of improvement, some night wood! 2 out of the last 3 nights. I think my body is so surprised (its been years) that everytime I pop one I wake up. I'll take some lost sleep for my boner back any day. They're not raging by any means but I'm only 1.5 wks in and I'll take any signs of improvement.

[Pegasus AdministratorPE Gym EditorPEGym Hero ☺ Admin of the Month Mar 2015 Find all posts View Profile Close Pegasus]

Great post! I have been doing kegels for a couple of weeks, but haven't noticed much yet. I have been doing every other day (off,on,off,on etc) 10 sec holds front normal, front reverse, back, back reverse (all 4 variations) x 10, so 40 altogether.
The first study link you provided said to do a lot more but doesn't say about different variations, so maybe I'm wasting my time with the reverse ones? And it doesn't say how many seconds to hold for at maximum contraction? just a blank _

I doubt they know reverse exists , you have access to cuting edge knowledge here.

[Mr McPenis Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mr McPenis]

Yeah the first study link was pretty specific about the exercises, it just didn't say how long to hold. Probably because everyone's PF has a different starting strength. But I know when they tested the participants PF strength they had them hold for 10s/rep. I'm doing each hold (standing, sitting, lying) for 15 seconds, with 15 seconds between reps. Its a good balance for me: I can finish the reps but the last few seconds are a struggle. When I walk I hold the kegel at ~50% of maximum, anywhere from 20s to 3 min, depending on how far I'm walking. The only thing I do differently from the study is I do kegels every other day, like you. Once I get stronger I will go every day.

As far as the reverse Kegels go, I'm not doing them because I'm trying to do exactly what they did in the study. I would suggest not doing them until you get your EQ where you want it. If that study's routine works, why change it? From my limited knowledge of reverse Kegels they are more for PE than ED. I may experiment with them once I'm satisfied with my EQ, but til then I'm sticking to the regular kegels while standing, sitting, lying, walking, and post-pissing.

What exactly is the difference between front and back regular kegels? Does the front work more towards your nuts and back towards your brown-eye?

I've had my first signs of improvement, some night wood! 2 out of the last 3 nights. I think my body is so surprised (its been years) that everytime I pop one I wake up. I'll take some lost sleep for my boner back any day. They're not raging by any means but I'm only 1.5 wks in and I'll take any signs of improvement.

I'm with you buddy. It makes sense to use the same routine so I started today, doing the routine given in the first study, 15 secs and every other day to start.
The reason I was doing reverse kegels is that I saw a thread where somebody was talking about not being able to maintain an erection without stimulation and big Al suggested reverse kegels to keep an erection without stimulation. I'm not sure about them but will not be doing them from now on and sticking with this routine. The difference between front and back is front is concentrated on the front end (as if holding in urine and passing it out fast as you can)and back is concentrated on the back end (Pulling anus in and pushing it out).
Good to hear your improvement. I agree, night time wood is worth a bit of lost sleep. In 1.5 weeks it's still early days so your making great progress!
Are you taking any supplements at all?

[EQr Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close EQr]

Awesome, lets keep tabs on each other's progress. I'll let you know of any breakthroughs or problems I have, hope you'll do the same. I think this way we can help each other out.
Supplements I take: 1. Kingpole's erection tea daily (the lemons make it bomb!) 2. Basic daily multivitamin 3. Soy protein shake after the gym (3-4x/week, I go with soy bc whey makes me feel shitty). Yourself?

Question: Are you able to work the front and back PF muscles while in the same position? I find it hard. I'm trying to pay special attention to the BC muscle in front, but have to either sit with my chest on my thighs or use that special slouched chair to really isolate it.

Took a long walk today and was kegeling at 50% for 4-5 minutes at a time. I felt it was a really good workout, and to my pleasant surprise, while doing them I felt a bit more sexually aroused than usual. That's one way to keep the kegels from getting boring...might have to start doing them every day soon!

[Mr McPenis Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mr McPenis]

Awesome, lets keep tabs on each other's progress. I'll let you know of any breakthroughs or problems I have, hope you'll do the same. I think this way we can help each other out.
Supplements I take: 1. Kingpole's erection tea daily (the lemons make it bomb!) 2. Basic daily multivitamin 3. Soy protein shake after the gym (3-4x/week, I go with soy bc whey makes me feel shitty). Yourself?

Question: Are you able to work the front and back PF muscles while in the same position? I find it hard. I'm trying to pay special attention to the BC muscle in front, but have to either sit with my chest on my thighs or use that special slouched chair to really isolate it.

Took a long walk today and was kegeling at 50% for 4-5 minutes at a time. I felt it was a really good workout, and to my pleasant surprise, while doing them I felt a bit more sexually aroused than usual. That's one way to keep the kegels from getting boring...might have to start doing them every day soon!

Awesome, I take a multi-vitamin (as everyone should!), low dose of Ginko biloba daily and I have ordered some l-arginine which I will start in a few days. I also go down the gym a fair bit and take lots of protein, as well as glutamine.

Have to say I already seem to be feeling a bit better after one day. I felt as though it was a bit easier to get an erection, and I felt the need to masturbate and 'release' this afternoon, which I don't normally get at all. I noticed that although I was not rock hard by any means, I had better control, although still needed constant stimulation, but not needing to go as 'hard at it' with my hand as I normally do, and getting the initial erection was not too difficult at all. I also noticed I took considerably less time to get to the ponr than usual with no visuals whatsoever, it normally takes me ages and I get bored and lose my erection, this time was much better.

I really am no expert at identifying the different muscle make ups but when I was trying to do my front muscles I generally visualise myself taking a piss and when do the standard one I imagine I'm pissing hard and have to hold it all in and reverse I am imagining I need to hurry up and piss as fast as I can to finish it. I used to do them in standing position. As for doing the back and the front at the same time, I felt it actually working at the back when concentrating on the front, but the concentrated energy was either on the back or the front, where I would feel it more. I couldn't do the standard front and reverse back or vice versa at the same time but can feel my anus clench slightly when I do a front kegel if you know what I mean?

Anyway, I think it's best not to overcomplicate it. What you're doing is obviously working. I am just concentrating on lifting my whole muscle, concentrating on it as a whole, lifting from between the anus and genitals.

The one difficulty I had with this routine is I keep on forgetting to lift it 50% when walking, but I guess the more you do it the more it becomes part of your general routine. Actually, another difficulty was when they say try not to tense your abdominals/buttock at maximum pf muscle contraction, how do you find this? I find it very hard to keep my abdominals relaxed.

I would definitely suggest you do them every day, as long as you feel ready. I was only planning on doing them every other day for the first week or so (I actually felt like doing them this morning again but decided to wait a bit). The group in the study done them every day from the beginning didn't they?

I think we are quite similar in our aims and it would be great to sort of 'work together' towards getting there, which I'm sure we can. Feel free to private message me or continue communicating on this thread, up to you.

Has you time of keeping erect without stimulation improved at all as well?

Are you also doing any other pe (jelqing etc)?