saiyan22's opinion on the science of PE base on my studies and experiance

[saiyan22 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close saiyan22]

Hey guys here's my take on the science of PE. Keep in mind this is not gosbal or anything. This is just my humble opinion on the matter so go easy on me. When it comes to the science of penis enlargement I think people should study more closely the science behind stretching and deforming connective tissue in general. Looking up the topic of stretching soft tissues or connective tissues on google will show you guys tons of information that you can relate PE with. I think one of the mistakes that people make when it comes to PE is they try to relate it to body building or working out your muscles to stimulate gains. The penis can not be tricked or stimulated into growing. It doesn't work that way. The penis does have smooth muscle in it but this smooth muscle does not enlarge because some guy starts doing a different or new PE excersise then he's use too. If a guy changes his PE routine and he starts making gains all of a sudden it's because he is finally doing something that's creating enough direct tension and load time to plastically deform the soft tissues of the penis. His penis wasn't tricked or stimulated to grow at all. What's happening is the new or different excersize that the guy is doing is turning out to be more efficent at placing the proper stress neccesary to induce CREEP which later leads to deformation and structural remodeling of the tissues.

In my humble opinion the penis is enlarged beyond it's natural starting size from plastic deformation and structural remodeling of the deformed tissue at a microscopic level. As more deformation and remodeling takes place in a accumilated fashion, the accumilation of remodeled and enlarged tissue will become a visuable and functional gain with time and consistancy. When it comes to rest days the main use for them is to prevent the the accumilated fatigue and deformation of the tissues from accumilating into dangerous levels of fatigue and deformation which can leed to imflamation and injury. Rest days are strictly individual and will be different for everybody.

Now when it comes to PE people have to realize that it takes time to enlarge your penis. People have to realize that you are trying to force your penis to enlarge in size dispite what your genitic make up had already set for you. To enlarge a body part that is done growing once you reach full adult hood is a time comsuming and scientific process. When you think of PE don't think the terms GROWING your penis because at full adult hood your penis is done growing. Once you hit 21-23 years old then that's a RAP fellas. Your not getting any bigger naturally. Instead when you think of PE think the term ENLARGING the penis. At full adult hood your penis will not grow anymore but you can ENLARGE it through plastic deformation and remodeling of it's tunica and ligaments and other connective tissues.

So all in all the main points that I wanted to get across with this essay is to understand that we are ENLARGING our penis's. Not GROWING our penis. Once purberty is done then that's all she wrote guys. There is no more growing of the penis at this point. The other main point that I wanted to reiderate is treating the penis like a skelital muscle you work out in the gym. The tissues of the penis enlarge through CREEP and plastic deformation then remodeling of the tissue at a microscopic level which will overtime accumilate to visible and functional gains as more deformation and remodeling takes place. Plastic deformation is completely time and load dependent. When one changes an excersize and he makes gains all of a sudden, it's because the new excersize he's doing is proven its self to be more efficient at creating the neccassary time under tension to deform the tissues.

[FadesIntoTheNight Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close FadesIntoTheNight]

Very interesting.

[Cleave Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Cleave]

I like it Saiyan! Can you explain the CREEP part? What is that an analogy for or is it a concept that I'm just not familiar with?

[Closed039 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Closed039]

I think he goes into Creep somewhere on his progress log. If not, check threads started by Saiyan on his profile.

Anyway, I think this is a pretty interesting take on PE, and I'm inclined to agree with most of it.

[Cleave Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Cleave]

Thank you skeptic

[calixto ModeratorPE Gym EditorPEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close calixto]

I like what Saiyan says about how we should try to use the term "enlarging" instead of growing. This helps us know that we are ADDING EXTRA INCHES to our natural penis. "Growing" implies a bit that we have not yet met out potential.

I DO think that some guys "gains" when the begin PE (especially the exercises, especially jelqing) is due more to a better EQ and they are seeing their true potential since they are now "working out" their penis, but as with building muscle via lifting weights, we all get to plateaus, and we all can eventually overcome them in many ways.

But... I think THIS is why a routine involving PE exercises combined with using an extender or hanging WILL SURELY ensure gains!!!

[Dicko Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Dicko]

Yes, I agree. This is the classical plastic deformation or PD theory. I haven't really heard of any growth theories except for the fake penis pill claims.

[Fli-Fisher Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Fli-Fisher]

Sayian that is some pretty interesting stuff man. I am interested in looking into it more now.

Your log is pretty crazy, I started reading it and I found after a half hour of reading I didn't even put a dent in the pages.

[saiyan22 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close saiyan22]

Hey thanks for the support guys. For the question on CREEP. Creep is the when the tissues temporarily elongate or expand beyond its elastic limit do to long term exposure to stretch forces and heat. Normally Creep is temporary deformation but after more time under tension is placed on the tissues, then Creep deformation reaches plastic deformation or perminant deformation which is what we are looking for. An example of this is lets say my normal unclamped girth is 5.5 inches. Now lets put on a cable clamp and say my clamped girth is 5.8 inches without any fluid build up. Now lets say that after 3 fifteen minute sets of clamping my clamped girth is now 6.1 inches without any fluid build up. When I first put the cable clamp on my clamped girth was 5.8 inches but after 3 fifteen minutes sets my clamp girth when beyond its elastic clamped limit of 5.8 inches to 6.1 inches. This was result of CREEP DEFORMATION which is only temporary deformation of the tissues. After an hour or two your girth goes back down to 5.5 inches unclamped. The key with CREEP is with constant and repeated bouts of time under tension on a daily basis, the tissues will eventually go beyond the CREEP phase into the plastic phase which is where the bonds of the tissues break and remodel at a micro scopic level. What we are looking for as PEers is constant deformation and remodeling of the tunica, ligs, and other connective tissues in a accumulative fashion.

[pe_ZEN Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close pe_ZEN]

More about collagen (tunica)

The principal structure in these tissues we need to consider is collagen. A key term used in physics and biomechanics to describe the way collagen behaves is 'viscoelasticity'.

Viscoelastic tissues are made up of viscous and elastic properties. A viscous tissue will deform and stay deformed permanently - if you pull on a piece of play dough, for instance, it will keep that shape. An elastic tissue will return to its original length when the force is removed. For example, pulling on a rubber band and letting go - the band snaps back to its original length. Viscoelasticity describes a property of tissues (collagen being one of those tissues) whereby deformation/lengthening of a tissue is sustained and the recovery is slow and imperfect when the deforming force has been removed. That is, it will stretch, then stay stretched for a while before slowly returning to its original length. Viscoelasticity tells us a number of practical things about stretching the connective tissues in muscle:

1. Studies on the cyclic loading of tissues suggest that most deformation occurs in the first stretch, and after four stretches there is little change in ultimate length. Therefore there is no extra benefit from stretching a muscle 10 times in one session.
2. It takes 12-18 seconds to reach stress relaxation, so there is no need to hold a stretch for longer than 20 seconds
3. Greater peak tensions and more energy are absorbed the faster the rate of stretch. This means that a tissue will generate greater tension if the rate of stretch is faster and therefore not achieve the same length as a tissue undergoing a slow stretch. That is, do passive stretches SLOWLY.
4. Once elongated, length changes are not rapidly reversible due to the viscous nature of the tissue. However, deformations are not permanent because the elastic properties will eventually bring the tissue back to its original length. Lasting changes come from adaptive remodelling of the connective tissues, not mechanical deformation. One study in South Africa showed that stretching every four hours was the most effective way to achieve elongation in a muscle. This may suggest that the temporary change in length following a stretch may start to regress after four hours (Grace Hughes, unpublished study).

[Lazy 8 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Lazy 8]

More about collagen (tunica)

The principal structure in these tissues we need to consider is collagen. A key term used in physics and biomechanics to describe the way collagen behaves is 'viscoelasticity'.

Viscoelastic tissues are made up of viscous and elastic properties. A viscous tissue will deform and stay deformed permanently - if you pull on a piece of play dough, for instance, it will keep that shape. An elastic tissue will return to its original length when the force is removed. For example, pulling on a rubber band and letting go - the band snaps back to its original length. Viscoelasticity describes a property of tissues (collagen being one of those tissues) whereby deformation/lengthening of a tissue is sustained and the recovery is slow and imperfect when the deforming force has been removed. That is, it will stretch, then stay stretched for a while before slowly returning to its original length. Viscoelasticity tells us a number of practical things about stretching the connective tissues in muscle:

1. Studies on the cyclic loading of tissues suggest that most deformation occurs in the first stretch, and after four stretches there is little change in ultimate length. Therefore there is no extra benefit from stretching a muscle 10 times in one session.
2. It takes 12-18 seconds to reach stress relaxation, so there is no need to hold a stretch for longer than 20 seconds
3. Greater peak tensions and more energy are absorbed the faster the rate of stretch. This means that a tissue will generate greater tension if the rate of stretch is faster and therefore not achieve the same length as a tissue undergoing a slow stretch. That is, do passive stretches SLOWLY.
4. Once elongated, length changes are not rapidly reversible due to the viscous nature of the tissue. However, deformations are not permanent because the elastic properties will eventually bring the tissue back to its original length. Lasting changes come from adaptive remodelling of the connective tissues, not mechanical deformation. One study in South Africa showed that stretching every four hours was the most effective way to achieve elongation in a muscle. This may suggest that the temporary change in length following a stretch may start to regress after four hours (Grace Hughes, unpublished study).

This is a great post, PEZ. Thanks for making it. I'd like to see further discussion of the most effective ways to achieve permanent changes, based on the principles of viscoelasticity.

[Wolfmesser Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Wolfmesser]

Thats an interesting theory. I especially liked the emphasis on the idea of enlargment rather than growing. I suppose it can be copmpared to the fact that after we reach full adulthood, our body type is done developing, thats it, some are naturall skinny and some are naturally beefy, but through workout out, you can develope you physique to look a certain way. Points for sure.

[Pretty1 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pretty1]

so this can be used for balooning then since in balooning we are rushing more blood into our penis and for that period time of balooning our penis is enlarged passed its normal state... the longer we go the more it enlarges so eventually it will enlarge permantly correct?

[Rubirosa Member Find all posts View Profile Close Rubirosa]

I don't buy this completely, otherwise, rest days would be irrelevant.

You said rest days would only be for the purpose of not inducing irritation from continuous PE.

I'd like to hear what some of the vets say about this.

[saiyan22 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close saiyan22]

A member asked me a question on plastic deformation in my pic thread. I answered his quesiton but I figured I just post my answer here as well to update my science thread.

Plastic deformation is when the molecular bonds of an object like human tissue breaks and remodels to adjust to the stress. The effects of plastic deformation is perminant. For human tissue to reach the plastic phase it has to go through the CREEP phase first. CREEP is when soft tissue stretches past it's elastic limit but this effect is temporary. Once the load that induces creep goes away then soft tissue reverts back to it's normal size. What we as PEers are tying to accomplish is constantley inducing creep with tension and stretch force on the tunica and ligs, whether it's from clamping, hanging, jelqing or pumping.

With repeated bouts of Creep induced tension in the pressence of heat, the molecular bonds in the soft tissue will eventually weaken and break and remodel at a new stretch or expanded size resulting in perminent tissue change and deformation. Once structural remodeling takes place of the newly deform tissue then the elastic limit of the tissue increases to a new threshold.

Through plastic deformation, we are creating new tissue mass and greater elasticity in our tunica and ligs. When the tunica generates more raw tissue mass and elasticity through plastic deformation then obviously the tunica will now be able to fill up with more blood before reaching it's elastic limit and pressurising into a rigid erection.

This will result in a bigger penis since the newly deformed tuncia's blood holding limit is now greater then before.
I break PE done into to types of PE. There's internal tunica stetching excersizes and external tunica stretching excersizes.

When it comes to PE it's all about stretching of the tunica and ligs. Even when you are clamping or jelqing it's still a form of stretching because the blood that's being pushed into the penis during these excersizes is increasing the internal pressure in the penis which is stretching the tunica outwards for girth gains. So I look at girth excersizes like clamping as internal stretching of the tunica.

The blood is what's being used internally to stretch the tunica outwards. Internal tunica stretching excersizes require blood. The blood engorment is what's building the pressure inside of the penis that's stetching the tunica in all directions for girth.
Examples of internal tunica stetching excersizes are, clamping, pumping, jelqing and erect bends.

Now when it comes to external tuncia stretching excersizes this is when no blood is required to stretch the tunica. external tunica stretching exersizes is when an outside force is being placed on the penis to stretch the tunica directly without using blood to build up any internal pressure.

Examples of external tunica stretching excersizes are manual stetches and hanging which hit's the ligs as well.

So all in all PE is about deforming the tunica and ligs though stretch force.

Internal tunica stretching excersizes like jelqs require blood and external stretching excersizes like hanging require no blood.

Another thing I want you guys to understand even though I said this before on that link that aidan784 set up to my science thread. When you do PE you are not growing your penis or stimulating your penis to grow. Sorry guys but It doesn't work that way. Once you are completely done with pubery which is around 20 to 23 years of age then that''s it my brothers. The fat lady has song. Your dick ain't growing any more. What you have at the age of 23 is all mother nature or your genetic make up has in store for you when it comes to growth.

At this point you can enlarge your penis through PE. Not grow you penis but ENLARGE your penis. This will be done by plastic deformation and structural remodeling of soft tissues of the penis.

Another thing that I have talked about is treating the penis like any other skelital muscle in the body that can grow from excersize. Sorry fellas but it doesn't work that way either. The penis does have smooth muscle in it but not the kind of muscle that can be stimulated for growth through workouts like lets say your chest or biceps. Doesn't work that way at all. The tissues in the penis deform from stress/ time under tenison.

That's all there is to it. TIME UNDER TENSION.

Let's use an imaginary guy named Bob. Let's say Bob has been doing manual stretches and jelqs for 2 years and has gained 1 inch in length and .25 in girth in over that 2 year period. Now let's say Bob has reached a platueo and can't gain another cenimeter to save his life because his ligs and tunica have toughen up and adapted to the tension that Bob's hands were putting on his dick.

Now lets say Bob changes up his excersize and starts hanging and clamping. Now after 6 months, Bob has broke out of his platueo and gain another half inch in lengh and a half inch in girth. The reason Bob broke out of his platueo is not because he changed his excersizes to keep his penis guessing so to say.

Bob broke out of his platueo because he is now applying the right amount of load and time under tension for plastic deformation to continue. The hanging and clamping is providing Bob's penis more load and time under tension then the manual stretches and jelqing that he was doing before.

Wether you are jelqing, clamping, pumping, stretching, or hanging. It's all about load and time under tension. Plastic deformation is time and load dependent.

These are the principles that I use during my PE workouts.