Average.

[Ivor Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ivor]

Alpha male makes me think of a confident, charismatic, intelligent & potentially prosperous person, can be a nice guy or an asshole.

Those might be the traits that an anthropologist or sociologist would consider to make up an "alpha male" human, if they were to consider humans in terms of primatology. I'm talking about guys who consider themselves an "alpha male", which is a bit different. To me, the whole idea just has "arrogant dickhead" written all over it.

[Brandon85 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Brandon85]

I'm not sure about "most". In ancient Greece and Rome, a small penis was considered part of the ideal of male beauty. Large penises were seen as bestial, comical, grotesque. The Kama Sutra describes the ideal penis as thick but short. I think it's important not to project our modern Western obsessions onto cultures from other parts of the world or from previous periods in history.



If were Dictator Of The Internet and could ban people from using any one phrase, it would probably be "alpha male". I mean come on, it's a term from primatology. Are you a man or a monkey? It's ridiculous. Every time I read it, it makes me think of some idiotic fratboy cunt downing cans of beer, crushing them on his forehead and then beating his chest while bellowing loudly to indicate his "alpha male" status, while the girls snigger at him and then carry on talking with the guy with a nice smile who knows how to dance and can make them laugh (with him, not at him).

Depending on one's belief (religion etc), "modern" man with a historical record is at best 5,000 years while man (again depending on ones beliefs etc) has been around for around 2 million years. 5k years of intellectualizated preferences would have a tough time competing with millions of years of evolution. If the romans saw a small penis as ideal, then that ideal would have still be prevalent today and biological forces would have widdled me to have small penis'.

And, back to evolutionary forces, alpha males exist in the animal kingdom. And whether we choose to accept it or not, we are still biological.

Study upon study have shown that women (in general and from a biological standpoint) would prefer to have a child from an alpha male (for genetic superiority) and have it raised by a beta male (for financial and relational stability).

There are underlying forces that drive each of us individually to mate with who we mate with. Just as that article about women who select males with different major histocompatibility complexes for reproduction then when pregnant (or the simulation of via birth control) prefer men with similar MHC's.

Birth Control Pills Affect Women's Taste in Men: Scientific American

[Ivor Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Ivor]

Depending on one's belief (religion etc), "modern" man with a historical record is at best 5,000 years while man (again depending on ones beliefs etc) has been around for around 2 million years.

Humans didn't exist 2,000,000 years ago. The earliest anatomically modern humans appeared about 200,000 years ago. Those are the dates from the fossils, whatever your beliefs happen to be.

5k years of intellectualizated preferences would have a tough time competing with millions of years of evolution. If the romans saw a small penis as ideal, then that ideal would have still be prevalent today and biological forces would have widdled me to have small penis.

This is totally confused. For one thing, humans today, even white humans, are not exclusively descended from ancient Romans. Second, the fact that it was considered an aesthetic ideal does not mean that no big-penised men ever got to have sex or reproduce. Look around you: is it the case that all the attractive people you know have loads of children, while the less attractive have none? Of course not. Being more attractive obviously widens your choice of partners but it's hardly a prerequisite for reproducing.

And when I say an aesthetic ideal, I mean it was considered beautiful from an artistic and more or less abstract POV. It's not necessarily a good indicator of what women looked for in a partner (to the extent that women had a choice in their partners, which in many past societies and some modern societies they don't, particularly) any more than the skinny, androgynous girls who model clothes in fashion shows represent what the average hetero guy finds attractive. I would bet that most women in the ancient Roman world, just like most women in modern societies, considered penis size to be less important than you think they thought it was.

My point was just that while it may seem 'obvious' to us these days that 'biggest is best', this has not always been the case and there have been cultures where big penises were considered undesirable. Following your argument, if women have always preferred larger penises then we'd eventually have a situation where penises get so big as to be functionally impractical for sex, which would be an evolutionary disaster. A sort of genital version of a peacock's tail.

It's true that humans have much bigger penises than other primates, but that probably comes from human babies being born with much bigger heads than other primates (because of our much bigger brains), which would require bigger vaginas in women and therefore a selection pressure for bigger penises to provide pleasure during sex. But this pressure would cease once human head size levelled off.

Study upon study have shown that women (in general and from a biological standpoint) would prefer to have a child from an alpha male (for genetic superiority) and have it raised by a beta male (for financial and relational stability).

So you're saying most women would rather have their children raised by a stepfather than their biological father? Bullshit. It happens a lot these days because parents divorce and remarry, but it's not generally considered ideal, is it? Can you produce a link to any of these hundreds of studies?

[ThirdArm Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close ThirdArm]

Variety will always be present in our genetics. For instance, some guys totally dig a woman with nice long labia. Some prefer the smallest possible. Nothing wrong with variety.

[Brandon85 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Brandon85]

It seems that the term 'average' ruffles a lot of feathers.

We are here to learn and grow. Being average is a luxury to me. It would make life so much more stable and less turbulent. Not talking about penis size. I am talking about life in general.

As for the 2 millions years, I was careful to state a disclaimer that the appearance of man is dependent on ones belief. Homo habilis (first 'homo' to appear in archaeological records) was present about 2.3 million years ago. And I also made a disclaimer to note that we, as humans, are biological. Though we try to suppress our animal urges with culture and intelligence, our carnal animal nature shows through time and time again.

I have read studies on women biologically driven to mate with genetically superior males. Whether it is hundreds or not. I am not in the business (nor have the time or patience to root through all that again) to look through and look for these studies.

From a personal experience, I have been propositioned twice to father children by women to be secretly raised as their husbands own children. And these are the ones that would go through with it. Who knows how many women think of it.

What makes a woman wanting to have children by another man to be raised by their husbands? I have no idea. Biology and raw animal instincts sometimes outweigh cultural norms and intelligence.

[TheSperminator Member of the Month Oct 12 Find all posts View Profile Close TheSperminator]

From a personal experience, I have been propositioned twice to father children by women to be secretly raised as their husbands own children. And these are the ones that would go through with it. Who knows how many women think of it.

What makes a woman wanting to have children by another man to be raised by their husbands? I have no idea. Biology and raw animal instincts sometimes outweigh cultural norms and intelligence.

That's so fucked up for the husbands .. Those men think they are raising their own child. Anyways, interesting stuff.

[BigO AdministratorPEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close BigO]

Call average something else and we just have another word for men to complain about. It is a completely pointless quest.
Lets knock off the crap about alpha males, not the purpose of the thread at all.

Did changing the word retard to mentally challenged change anything for them?

[TTBB Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close TTBB]

Thanks to all who have taken the time to post and pm me.

[islander Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close islander]

Tinks idea about no starting stats is the best I have ever heard. Fantastic!

There is no word IMO that can be used ever which includes the word average. I don't know anyone that wants to hear the word average about anything. Unless you are describing a non living thing. We are not trained to accept that word. From grade school through college we dont want below average or average. We want the higher than average marks. The pediatrician when doing the growth charts and development charts we want above average. IQ tests we want above average. So because that word is drilled in all through our formative years as an "ugh" word I cant see how people can just accept it because they are an adult.

I will never use the word average when pertaining to a penis. I will never answer the question if my partner asks (previous sizes inside my vagina) and if he asks I will be so insulted I hope I can recover and forgive him. Watch, listen and feel how you make me feel. Period. That is is all.

[Closed039 Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Closed039]

Yup Islander, that is a good post, I agree.

[somebodyelse Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close somebodyelse]

I'd say just call it what it is!

a "Good Size"...

There's Okaysize range on both sides of "good size" and then there's "not so good size" on both sides of the "good" range...

"not so good" because it was too big and "not so good" because it was too small. and we're talking Micro Size and Macro size here 8" girths and stuff.

[islander Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close islander]

Try this exercise. Look at yourselves in the mirror and say these lines as if you are responding to a question.

She's of average looks
She has average intelligence
She has an average job
Her boobs are average

It's unlikely you did not nod your head down or to the side as if in defeat. When nodding up its defensive. Either option is received/perceived as sad or negative.

Do the same but about yourself.
I'm a average height
I'm of average intelligence
I have an average salary

Most of the time you stare right into their eyes and don't move your head at all

When referencing a non living thing it's a sale and a completely different body language.

I can't imagine calling a friend in the morning saying in my most excited voice
OMG Tammy I met the most fantastic average guy last night!!! Yay!!!

Our society is just not wired like this.
But the thread is about a positive word for a regular common normal size penis rather than using the almighty awful word average. I have no answer. Lol

[someone_like_u Retired ModeratorPEGym Hero Find all posts View Profile Close someone_like_u]

The word average seems to insult and be taken as a negative by men.
So what is another word that we could re-brand the mid range penis? a word that doesn't offend male ego? a word that can be used proudly..
It always amazes me how many take the word average in a negative way when its being used as a positive.

any ideas?

How about universal, classic, or maybe conventional?

[somebodyelse Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close somebodyelse]

Every girls "good" size is perfect for her. That's the point of it. If a guy is a "good" size, then he's good for her. It could be 4-6" it could be 7-9" Whatever is good for the girl is her "good" size range.

This brings up the video the woman being called "average" down there. I posted it and dudes pissed and moaned about her talking about penis size of guys... She was saying how much of a crushing blow it was to be called "average" down there...

A whole bunch of guys got pissed off because she was talking about penis size... she was on the guys' side and they still got pissed off. It's crazy to me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=4cYI4QFJGGA

The only problem I have is that she's had surgery to shrink her vagina.

Listen to the pain in her voice as she listened to some guy basically say she had the equivalent of a "Small Penis"... It was pretty damning. and "Average" didn't make her feel better about herself. Average is not the way to describe someone...

That's why I say "Good"... It's good if it makes you feel good.

[somebodyelse Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close somebodyelse]

I should say that "average" is the wrong word anyway...

the most commonly occuring size range (5.5-5.75" BPEL) wouldn't be called the "average" it would be called the "mode"